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God has to be given permission to work in this earth realm on behalf of man…Yes! You are in control!
-- Frederick Price, Prayer: Do You Know What Prayer Is…and How to Pray? The Word Study Bible, 1178
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Exclusive: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist
Posted on Monday, June 04 @ 14:57:57 PDT by Kurt Simmons |
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by Kurt Simmons
When I first became active in the area of eschatology, I was asked to participate as a columnist at Planet Preterist. I accepted and, for a time, enjoyed the ability to post articles there at will. However, I have since come to feel that Planet Preterist is an irresponsible forum that is used to promote unbiblical doctrines, including post-Modernism, Emergent church theology, and Universalism, to name but a few. Despite its ostenisible purpose to promote Preterist interpretation of scripture, it has probably done more to injure Preterism than help it by allowing Preterism to become associated with so many unbiblical, irresponsible, and just plain "flakey" doctrines. I do not feel in good conscience that I can have my name associated with Planet Preterist as a columnist. I do not agree with what is taught or promoted here, and do not want to appear to condone it by lending it my name. This has been a difficult decision for me, but I feel it is the right one, particularly in light of the present crisis regarding Universalism.
Therefore, please remove my name as a columnist.
Kurt M. Simmons
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Kurt Simmons is a columnist for PlanetPreterist.com.
View Kurt Simmons archives
Note: Opinions presented on PlanetPreterist.com or by PlanetPreterist.com columnists may not necessarily reflect the position of PlanetPreterist.com, or reflect the beliefs, doctrine or theological position of all other preterists. We encourage all readers to first and foremost carefully analyze all articles in the light of God's Word.
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
 by Ed on Monday, June 04 @ 16:37:33 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
ed
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
 by Virgil on Monday, June 04 @ 16:51:04 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Thanks for this last note Kurt - I appreciate your honesty.
Now for my side of the story, I believe you are leaving because I asked you to stop attacking Tim and Max King. Because you can no longer do that, you are throwing a fit and making a public statement by posting this message here; all the while you did not mind me endorsing your book, promoting it heavily here on the site and advertising your conferences to thousands of regular users. :)
I hope God will bless whatever future endeavors you'll continue to take and continue to open your mind to the wonderful new possibilities open by His fulfilled prophecy. |
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Sad and Disturbed (Score: 1)
 by EWMI on Monday, June 04 @ 18:46:09 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | I am sad and disturbed to see you go Kurt. While not always understanding your conclusions about some things, your work is always excellent and well thought out. Your contributions on what true Preterism is and your willingness to take on Universalism etc are valued and important. In my own personal study I can say that you have influenced my undersanding of things eschatological more than anyone outside of Don Preston.
You are a critical thread in the complex fabric of Covenant Eschatology today.
Al Persohn
Pastor, Botany City Church |
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
by Jhedges on Monday, June 04 @ 20:04:58 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt,
I can understand where you are coming from. I at one time thought that PP was a breeding place for future Buddhist and Bono worshipers. Now, there is theology that is espoused that gets under my skin. And there is theology that I love, that gets under other peoples skin.
The thing I realized that Planet Preterist was set up as a “preterist” website. Not a reformed preterist site or a Jewish orthodox post trib anti Mormon site.
Preterism. Plain and simple.
Sure some here think the emeren church is great, while others think its a fad*myself included*
There are some here like Sam or Neb that write from a reformed perspective.
The value of the different ideas being espoused is the dialogue it creates. I personally do not like any form of Universalism/Comp grace and theology along those lines.
Some people write about it. But its though perspectives that help me learn where they are coming from and why.
So, go where you feel you need to go. But if you walk away, there will be many missed opportunities to share what you believe.
God bless
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- by Jhedges on Monday, June 04 @ 20:06:38 PDT
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- by Basementman on Tuesday, June 05 @ 08:57:12 PDT
Dishonest Diatribe (Score: 1)
 by davo on Tuesday, June 05 @ 02:30:04 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) |
In Kurt's last article here on PP in one of his responses to someone else's comment he declared the following:
I deny I have misunderstood or misrepresented King's views. I challenge you or anyone to prove it. I challenge King to prove it. Until you can prove it, I stand my ground. But that I have not misunderstood him is clear from the fact that the Universalist crowd has understood him the same way.
I must say that Kurt Simmons' dishonesty is disappointing, thought not to be expected for someone who champions himself as a defender of truth against the wiles of "universalism" – something he no doubt has labeled myself as. But in all honesty, Kurt has chosen rhetoric over reply and HAS NOT interacted with the various issues I have raised that are pertinent to this area of sotierology. I among a few have posted some responses to some of Kurt's points and yet while answering most others HAS NOT or perhaps in more likelihood CANNOT answer to the consistency of which a consistent prêteristic hermeneutic lends itself in regards to the "realised redemption" of the comprehensive and inclusive nature that I among others have shared for some time.
Simmons for some time now, for reasons probably more personal, has made it his business to deride and decry the likes of Max King with his endless charges of "universalism" – charges that he claims are according to Max's to-date works etc, and berates him otherwise for not having clarified further his position – CLEARLY again Simmons is relying on King's available material to bring such allegations. Simmons in claiming not to misrepresent King's views now says: "I challenge you or anyone to prove it" otherwise. In light of this I submit the following:Where does man go today when he experiences physical death? This depends on upon his state before God at the time of death. If he is a faithful citizen of the everlasting kingdom he will be resurrected to a full and complete spiritual state of existence in that eternal kingdom which was entered by spiritual birth during his fleshly sojourn. If he is found outside of that kingdom, or disinherited, he is consigned to an eternal Hell, known as the second death.
p. 179 'The Spirit Of Prophecy' 3rd printing 1990 [1971] Although I do not have Max's more recent and updated 2002 2nd edition on hand, I did read similar sentiments in it as well. For Simmons to make these spurious claims based on King's works in print is patently mischievous, dishonest and uncharitable – and blatantly false.
Whatever may be "speculated" about Max King's present views is simply that, speculation – until such time as Max "clarifies" otherwise. Either way, IF anyone can construe "universalism" out of the in print quote above then they'll give Houdini a run for his money.
None of that however excuses the shabby and dubious treatment by Simmons of Max King works – works he claims he knows; neither misunderstanding nor misrepresenting them – cough, cough!!
davo – pantelism.com –
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- by mazuur on Tuesday, June 05 @ 09:58:37 PDT
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
 by Mick on Tuesday, June 05 @ 04:47:49 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | This is a sad day. I, in the past, and I believe many others have found this site as one place we felt "safe" too speak what is on our hearts. I am sorry you do not find this a safe place any more
Mickey |
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
by Marty on Tuesday, June 05 @ 05:27:57 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | "Note: Opinions presented on PlanetPreterist.com or by PlanetPreterist.com columnists may not necessarily reflect the position of PlanetPreterist.com, or reflect the beliefs, doctrine or theological position of all other preterists. We encourage all readers to first and foremost carefully analyze all articles in the light of God's Word."
So....This disclaimer at the end of each and every column means nothing? As a "lurker" on several preterist websites, I rather enjoy being able to read a variety of opinions and thoughts in order to keep challenged in my thinking and to remain humble in my understanding of the Word of God. Once I've decided I have arrived at complete understanding, I believe I am most at risk of becoming a fool. For who among us has not changed their mind on doctrine a time or two. Looking at your articles over time, Kurt, I see you have changed your opinion on things several times. You are condemning others for not being where you are now? Those of us who love to study the scriptures and seek out the truth are sometimes most at risk of violating the wisdom of 1Cor.13:1-7.
PS...Maybe this is the time to ask the question that has been lurking in my mind in the recent "Universalism" debate....why are christians so adamant and happy about sending people to everlasting torment? Nothing gets the hair raising rage going like a suggestion that the gospel is actually "Good News/Glad Tidings"... unconditionally. My experience has been that most people we think are going to experience the fires of everlasting condemnation of hell are already living in their own personal hell. So what was that "good news" again? :) |
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- by Virgil on Tuesday, June 05 @ 06:26:41 PDT
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
by MiddleKnowledge on Wednesday, June 06 @ 06:33:20 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Good-bye Kurt,
It's been fun,
Tim Martin
www.truthinliving.org |
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
by SuperSoulFighter on Thursday, June 07 @ 16:29:42 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | I just wanted to echo many of the sentiments being expressed concerning the openness of this site to a variety of views, ideas and beliefs falling within the Preterist camp (in the broadest sense and terms). I believe it's very healthy to consider openly and honestly the various potential ramifications of our eschatology, and how our somewhat controversial treatment of the Scriptures (where mainstream Churchianity is concerned) impacts the various areas of Christian doctrine as a whole. If newcomers to Preterism find some of these things unsettling, they may also find our generous consideration of conflicting and alternative views refreshing and it might even give them a whole, new perspective in certain areas.
I don't see this site promoting any one, specific doctrine or position per se. Whatever Mr. Simmons' experience has been here...I tend to shy away from any site that endorses a very restrictive, limited understanding with artificially-established, arbitrary interpretive parameters where the Scripture are concerned. If this is the kind of site Mr. Simmons prefers...I applaud his decision to move on. Godspeed, sir!
JM |
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- by Ed on Thursday, June 07 @ 19:03:11 PDT
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- by Ed on Friday, June 08 @ 05:18:49 PDT
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Re: Why I have Decided to Discontinue All Association with Planet Preterist (Score: 1)
by Kent on Sunday, June 10 @ 13:41:46 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt,
I can't blame you. Universalism is NOT taught in the scirptures. Scriptures that are use are taken out of context. There are still things that God "hated" before and after 70ad. Proverbs 6:12-19, Mal. 2:16. These things did NOT change after 70ad.
To say that we don ‘t have to practice living for God anymore? Col. 3:17 is wrong.
To say that Ecc. 12:13 does not apply to us or the concept, is wrong.
To say that 1 Thessalonians 4:3 does not apply to us or is it now ok to be sexual immoral, is wrong.
To say that the rules or guidelines for marriage is not for us, is wrong.
To say that we can do all of the above, because of grace is misusing the freedom given.
Presense, aka The Living Presense, were asked by me if the believed in Universalism, meanding that everyone in the world since 70ad were going to be saved or go to heaven after physical death, since they believe we are in heaven now (I understand were they are coming from in their logic) a straight answer was not given. I don't know their views on the subject, if they even have one. Since they believe that marriage and other things do not apply to us after 70ad, they in my thoughts are missing the boat.
Things like this are proving my point that Preterism (all forms) have failed. It is just another doctine that came and gone over time. In the 70's and 80's, the movement was strong and unity was there and now who wants to believe in this doctrine. A hosue divided falls.
After 30 years, Preterism (all forms, FP, IP, MP, PP, HP and anyother form that has yet to come)have failed proving it points.
What every happened to the Bible (scriptures) only have one meaining?
Richard
www.preterism-eschatology.com
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