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News: A Disarmed Campus
Posted on Tuesday, April 17 @ 09:00:48 PDT by Mickey Denen

Society By John Tabin
In January 2006, Virginia Delegate Todd Gilbert introduced House Bill 1572, which was meant to guarantee, with a few exceptions, that students with concealed handgun permits would be allowed to carry guns on college campuses. The bill died in subcommittee later that month. Like many schools, Virginia Tech had a policy prohibiting guns on campus, and Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hincker expressed pleasure at the bill's defeat. "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions," said Hincker, "because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."

As we all know by now, the gun ban didn't insure safety. Virginia Tech was the site of the worst shooting spree in American history yesterday. Thirty-two people are dead -- not including the shooter, who committed suicide -- and at least fifteen are injured. Mightn't a law-abiding armed student might have stopped the spree in its tracks? We'll never know.

Perhaps some school administrators still think that declaring a "gun-free zone" makes a campus safer; that was what legislators thought when they started passing gun bans at high schools in response to the late-'80s youth-crime spike. But it's likely that at the college level, fear of litigation plays a large role in shaping such policies. No school or business has been successfully sued following an on-site incident involving a gun, but according to David Kopel, director of the Second Amendment Project at the Independence Institute, "that doesn't stop administrators from being scared." Kopel notes that big business is afflicted by the same lawsuit-paranoia. "If you look in these corporate counsel manuals...you'll find these things all over the place, saying that you should adopt a no-guns policy so you don't get sued -- when there's really never been a case of a successful suit," says Kopel.

The irony, Kopel points out, is that Virginia Tech may have opened itself up to a lawsuit anyway. Two people were killed several hours before the rest of the victims, and many have complained that the school didn't warn people of the situation before the killing started again. "This interval and failure to warn, after having affirmatively disarmed them...I'm not a Virginia tort expert," says Kopel, "but that strikes me as a good start" for an enterprising litigator. Perhaps the reluctance to release the news flowed from the same central-command instincts that led administrators to disarm their students.

To gun control advocates, the failure of an anti-gun regulation just proves the need for more anti-gun regulations. The Brady Campaign's website had a newly designed "Donate Now" button referencing Virginia Tech almost immediately. It's worth asking, though, if guns aren't that different from information, and if it wouldn't be better to loosen control over both.

http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=11306


 
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Re: A Disarmed Campus (Score: 1)
by Chris on Tuesday, April 17 @ 10:26:19 PDT
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I wonder what that Larry Hincker guy is thinking now...


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Re: A Disarmed Campus (Score: 1)
by Islamaphobe on Tuesday, April 17 @ 11:57:00 PDT
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We shall, of course, now be subjected to a prolonged media campaign to support more extensive gun control legislation, and I must admit that I find myself wondering how this fellow procured such a lethal weapon. Unfortunately, if our society cannot stop the flow of cocaine, heroin, etc. into the country, and it appears that it cannot, I doubt that it will be able to eliminate the gun problem we have no matter how much anti-gun legislation is passed. The problem of our society is fundamentally a moral one, and my perception is that the moral rot is getting worse. And I don't think I feel that way just because I have gotten old. Folks, we in this particular religious movement have a lot of work cut out for us!


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Re: A Disarmed Campus (Score: 1)
by psychohmike (imapreterist before the @ and gmail.com after it) on Tuesday, April 17 @ 12:47:30 PDT
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Since in California non-criminals have the same rights as criminals. Problem is most criminals don't have the same regard for the law that I do. And I hate the fact that someone like me is held captive by those that use weapons for the wrong reasons.

Oh well...whatever!!!


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The Other Part of the 2nd Amendment (Score: 1)
by Windpressor (Giddi_one) on Wednesday, April 18 @ 01:02:56 PDT
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*******************

The hand ringing about supposed lax gun laws has begun --

==============
By PAISLEY DODDS
LONDON - The Virginia Tech shootings sparked criticism of U.S. gun control laws around the world Tuesday. Editorials lashed out at the availability of weapons, and the leader of Australia — one of America's closest allies — declared that America's gun culture was costing lives.
...

While some focused blame only on the gunman, world opinion over U.S. gun laws was almost unanimous: Access to weapons increases the probability of shootings. There was no sympathy for the view that more guns would have saved lives by enabling students to shoot the assailant.
...
...

[[Read full article at --
U.S. Gun Laws Draw Heat After Massacre ]]
================


**
There is that part of the 2nd Amendment that is about more than armament:
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, ..."

None of surveillance systems, rent-a-cops, professional policing, SWAT programs nor any so called "war on ______"
can rightfully make a claim of "being necessary ...".
A well regulated militia founded in the people's right to armament is a missing component in modern culture.
Is there any institution, effort, policy, program, or idea more suitable "to the security of a --
free State" or --
campus or --
neighborhood or --
community -
than the wisdom of the founding thoughts embodied in the concept of a regular group posted, imbedded or on patrol.

Sure, there is potential for a fraternity militia to engage in the petty harassments of a glorified hall monitor club, employ bullying or even deploy gang intimidations. Such paranoia is not well directed; we already have these perversions in the ordered establishments (and outlawed proclivities).
It is not about the availability of guns or the ineffectuality of gun laws. It is about the viability of a regular citizen group to regulate the security of their own freedom, as well as possible, against any threat. Whether it be from projectiles, combustibles, explosives or noxious dispersants, the effectual impetus is about thwarting a disturbed one or some deluded many that are all too ready for malevolent destruction.

What is it about the word "Militia" that evokes apprehension? Why not just as well say a "well discipled ecclesia", an "enlightened fellowship" or a "committed organization". For that matter, take any affiliation or agency and consider as a special interest militia: ACLU, MADD, NOW, DEA, NORML, PETA, PTL, UAW, ... Militias? In a number of ways, yes. Well regulated? Debatable.

G1
...........................



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Re: A Disarmed Campus (Score: 1)
by Theolog on Wednesday, April 18 @ 08:20:56 PDT
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We live in a community that solves some of its problems by killing other people. Why should it seem strange for our mixed kids to kill others to solve their problems? When even the “thou shall not kill” bunch is leading the charge to revenge 9-11 by killing thousands of our neighbors it should seem normal for a mixed up kid to dust a few of the people that were making his life miserable.

When our society looks upon killing to solve its problems with complete horror we can expect that things will change, until then we may need our guns.

We can thank God that our government is not lining the highways with crucifixions all in the name of peace. Things are better now than 2000 years ago but there is still a long way to go.


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Re: A Disarmed Campus (Score: 1)
by Starlight on Friday, April 20 @ 09:42:35 PDT
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News is coming forth now that possibly the shooter at Virginia Tech should have been restricted from purchasing the weapons he used in his killings. Apparently Virginia has laws on hand to restrict the mentally incompetent from purchasing weapons. You can read the complete account at the following link.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18217741/site/newsweek/

It seems to be though how incompetent you are indicates whether you will fall through the cracks.

“Contrary to initial reports, Cho may not have been legally eligible to acquire the two semi-automatic weapons that he used to murder more than 30 students at the school on Monday. Critics say Cho was able to collect his firearms without a hitch because of a gaping hole in the enforcement of existing federal gun laws that routinely allows mentally unstable people to buy deadly firearms.”

Also another prohibiting problem arises that many states are very protective of turning over their mental health records.

“In 1998, a man named Russell Weston killed two police officers in a shootout at the U.S. Capitol, using a .38-caliber gun that he had acquired with a gun permit he got from his home state of Illinois. When he filled out his federal form, he answered, like Cho, that he had no record of mental illness. Illinois officials were unaware that Weston had been ordered to a mental institution for a 90-day evaluation in Montana two years earlier. Why didn't they know? Montana's strict privacy laws prevent the reporting of commitments to law enforcement.”


The natural question arises should we federally mandate that those who show signs of mental illness be restricted from weapon purchases. If so where does it logically stop? What kind of visit to mental health facilities trigger these restrictions? Would depression, anger management treatment, abusive relationship counseling or paranoia and schizophrenia? Where do we draw the line to restrict someone’s rights for the protection of the general public?

Unfortunately this is a church problem as well, how many times have we heard of unstable parishioners coming to church and killing the members.

These are just a few questions that pop into my mind when I read this article.

Blessings

Norm



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JOHN MCLAUGHLIN: Bum Rap by Foreigners (Score: 1)
by Windpressor (Giddi_one) on Wednesday, April 25 @ 00:01:44 PDT
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****************

An interesting segment from PBS TV:
The McLaughlin Group --

==================
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Issue Two: International Fallout.

As the homicidal horror at Virginia Tech unfolded, it wasn't just Americans reacting with horror and with disgust. News outlets from around the globe brought the tragedy home to millions of international viewers. ...

[ commentary from videotape - UK, Germany, South Korea ]

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Moralizing from the prime minister of Australia.

JOHN HOWARD (prime minister of Australia): (From videotape.) We took action to limit the availability of guns, and we shared a national resolve that the gun culture that is such a negative in the United States would never become a negative in our country.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Let's ignore Prime Minister John Howard's sanctimony. Foreign countries with stricter gun laws will blame our, quote-unquote, "gun culture." But those killed in the Virginia Tech attacks included victims from all around the world. Their killer was also a foreigner. The killers at 9/11 were foreigners, but most of the dead were Americans.

So are these two tragedies more a reflection on the rest of the globe than America? Are Americans entitled to feel that they are being victimized as a consequence of their open society, which welcomes foreign visitors and immigrants?
I ask you, Pat Buchanan. Quick answer.

MR. BUCHANAN: Look, no, the Koreans are a very law-abiding people, ... And 9/11 is utterly different. ...

MS. CLIFT: The world is aghast at the way we are drenched in gun violence, and they're right. And I think the Australian --

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Is it a bum rap because these crimes were committed by foreigners?

MS. CLIFT: No, absolutely not. They could have been Americans. We've had many crimes here committed by Americans.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Do you see the point of the question?

MR. BLANKLEY: I understand the point. I don't agree with it. The propensity to violence is inherent in humans, not in any particular group. I would point out that right now London has a higher crime rate than New York. I'm sick of Europeans expressing that America is a violent country. Europe has been the most violent continent for 2,000 years.

MS. CLIFT: They don't have guns.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Quickly.

MR. O'DONNELL: Timothy McVeigh was not a foreigner. The shooter from the Texas tower was not a foreigner. The Columbine kids were not foreigners. It has nothing to do with that. Eleanor is right. The Australians are right. We are wrong.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Is it nevertheless a bum rap for foreigners to bill us as being victims or proponents of a gun culture?

MR. O'DONNELL: We have a fetishistic gun culture in this country that leads to these things inevitably.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: But the foreigners -- the volume of the deaths caused by these crimes exceeds any volume of any combination of other mass murderers in our history, 9/11 and Virginia Tech.

MS. CLIFT: We have 240 million guns in this country. And the number of gun deaths, unnecessary gun deaths, every year would dwarf any figures that you just cited.

MR. MCLAUGHLIN: .The answer to my question: It is a bum rap and it's a dirty rap
==============={Emphasis Added}


THE MCLAUGHLIN GROUP
BROADCAST: WEEKEND OF APRIL 21-22, 2007 TRANSCRIPT

.................


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