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"In the 38th chapter of Ezekiel, it says that the land of Israel will come under attack by the armies of the ungodly nations, and it says that Lybia will be among them. Do you understand the significance of that? Lybia has now gone communist, and that's a sign that the day of Armageddon isn't far off."
-- Ronald Reagan
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by Kurt Simmons
Here is something that should make red-blooded American men and women sit up and take notice. Keith Ellison, D-Minn., the first Muslim elected to the United States Congress, has announced that he will not take his oath of office on the Bible, but on the book of Islam, the Koran. What can be said when a country so far drifts from its beginnings that a Muslim is elected to Congress and will use the Koran to be sworn in? Was 9/11 so long ago that we have forgotten already the lessons of that dark day? Muslim countries are not free; the Koran cannot liberate its people. Muslim countries are backward, third world dictatorships, marked by corruption, oppression and violence. What possible motive could persuade us to allow official recognition of the Koran here?
The Bible is the very foundation of western civilization; our forebears grew up from uncivilized and barbarous tribes with the gospel and Bible. Every institution of western civilization is touched by the Bible's influence, from government and family, to our jurisprudence and customs and manners of every day life. Indeed, our very calendar is marked by the birth of the Savior and our holidays commemorate the day when God became flesh and was born a babe in Bethlehem. In Muslim countries this is not the case.
What does it say for the future of America when people no longer care? It seems as if the men of this country have been neutered by affluence and worldly cares. Nothing, no matter how egregious, seems to move us. It might interfere with our retirement plans or cost us something. One wonders what it will take to stir us up to action or even to arms (is it permissible to say that? Is the notion we should be willing to suffer and die for what we believe permitted to Christian men today, or must we simply sit passively by and while our country and civilization are lost to Christ and our children?).
It seems as if every religious persuasion in the world has a country where it is the official religion of the land, except Christianity. Christianity alone must accommodate every other minority faith in the world, even to the insult and denial of its own institutions. Let one atheist complain, and a whole community must abandon prayers in its school graduation ceremonies; let one antichrist complain and away with the manger scene on the court house lawn! We are told this is a democracy where the majority rules; why then can a tiny minority of atheists control a whole community or nation? Stupid Christians we! When will we awake to realize the nation our pilgrim forebears crossed the Atlantic to found has slipped from between our fingers, wrested from our grasp by a tiny minority of those opposed to everything our nation was founded upon? To what corner of the world shall we flee when America is finally lost?
More is at stake than our political institutions. Souls are in the balance. Tens of millions of school children are growing up in a country that is becoming increasingly secular and anti-Christian. The testimony of ruined lives is everywhere about us: broken marriages, single parent homes, unwed mothers, families with children from multiple fathers who don’t even look alike, drug and alcohol abuse, immodest apparel, homosexuality, child-abuse, youth gangs and violence. These are problems we hardly knew a few short decades ago. How did it change so fast? What must we do to turn it back? It is said that 70% of children in church attending families grow up and are lost to Christ. Little wonder when the faith of their fathers makes so little difference in their lives and country. If Christ mattered to us, he would matter to our children. And maybe that is where the problem is. It should make us sit up and take stock of what we really stand for and believe.
What can be said when a Muslim is elected to Congress and the Koran will be used to swear him in?
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Kurt Simmons is a columnist for PlanetPreterist.com.
View Kurt Simmons archives
Note: Opinions presented on PlanetPreterist.com or by PlanetPreterist.com columnists may not necessarily reflect the position of PlanetPreterist.com, or reflect the beliefs, doctrine or theological position of all other preterists. We encourage all readers to first and foremost carefully analyze all articles in the light of God's Word.
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Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
 by davo on Monday, December 04 @ 16:45:45 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) |
Keith Ellison, D-Minn., the first Muslim elected to the United States Congress, has announced that he will not take his oath of office on the Bible, but on the book of Islam, the Koran.
What can be said when a Muslim is elected to Congress and the Koran will be used to swear him in? I'm not American nor am I Muslim, but in light of Mt 5:33-37 are we as Christians supposed to "swear an oath" on the Bible? Also, wasn't this guy duly and democratically elected under your "fair and balanced" system – the fruit of the same kind of democracy you are seeking to impose on other Islamic counties? There seems to be something amiss here.
davo
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- by Malachi on Monday, December 04 @ 17:26:16 PST
- by Barry on Monday, December 04 @ 21:34:25 PST
- by davo on Tuesday, December 05 @ 02:09:49 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
 by chrisliv on Monday, December 04 @ 18:08:58 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Gee,
Pretty naive to claim that the Bible is the foundation of Western civilization.
Warfare, plunder, genocide, and colonialism is the foundation of the West.
If you think about the title of the article, "Exiles In Our Own Land", for more than a few seconds, it may occur to some how hypocritical American Zionism sounds to some.
Christ stated:
"The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors. But ye shall not be so..."
Clergy and Christians have been disobedient to that command ever since they incorporated under Caesar Constantine and the State, beginning at the Edict of Milan and finally fully enmeshing with a bloody Emperor by the Council of Nicea.
Now, churchgoers zealously worship a State that was founded by slaveholding Deists, who long ago stated in the Treaty of Tripoli, signed by the 5th US Congress and US President John Adams, at Article 11 that "the government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
The Bible may be customary, but a Phone Book would suffice, when in futher disobedience to Christ by "swearing" allegiance to the United State.
Peace to you all,
C. Livingstone
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- by Barry on Wednesday, December 06 @ 10:29:15 PST
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, December 06 @ 12:47:22 PST
- by Barry on Wednesday, December 06 @ 20:57:21 PST
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, December 06 @ 21:58:18 PST
- by Barry on Wednesday, December 06 @ 22:25:52 PST
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, December 06 @ 23:20:12 PST
- by Barry on Thursday, December 07 @ 07:07:21 PST
- by chrisliv on Thursday, December 07 @ 11:41:23 PST
- by Barry on Friday, December 08 @ 08:19:50 PST
- by chrisliv on Friday, December 08 @ 11:02:37 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
 by Islamaphobe on Monday, December 04 @ 18:23:29 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt,
It seems to me that the awareness of the truth of much of what you have written here is one of the factors that keeps some Christians wedded to futurist theologies. They perceive that the social fabric of the nation is deteriorating and that the dominance of "liberal" and secular values in the media, our educational system, our courts, and much of our political life seems firmly established and beyond the power of Bible-believing Christians to roll back. They therefore look for a Second Coming that they hope will occur in the near future and effect an abrupt change that ushers in the Eternal Kingdom of futurist theologies.
Judging by our preterist understanding of history and Scripture, God does not work that way. The Bible teaches us that God does intervene in history and that humanity is moving toward the establishment of the divine kingdom spoken of in Daniel 2, Isaiah 2, and Micah 4. And while it is easy to be pessimistic about our immediate prospects, we must not lose sight of the fact that Christianity is growing rapidly in Africa, Asia, and, I believe, Latin America. Moreover, I believe that Bible-based Christianity is gaining adherents in this country and even in Europe. It is vitally important that people with ruined lives or whose lives are on the path to ruin be kept aware of the fact that Christianity offers them a way out. That means that Christians must be visible and unhesitant about expressing what they believe, and they must contest non-Christians for political power and for the ability to influence our culture. We cannot afford to withdraw to our churches and let the rest of the world go its own way.
As for Islam, most people in this nation do not yet seem to have learned enough about it to understand that its theology is incompatible with American democracy. I do not deny that many Muslims are peace-loving people who can and do fit into American society as long as they don't take their religion very seriously. Unfortunately, there is no escaping the fact that many Muslims who do take their religion seriously either are at war with the rest of the world or agree that, in principle, it is their duty to support such war. Moreover, Muslims in general have learned how to take advantage of the possibilities that our culture offers to them for gaining special treatment. Our media, our educational institutions, and most of our politicians seem determined to ignore the truth about Islam and the nature of the war we are in; but with every passing day, thanks largely to the Internet, more people are coming to understand the basics of Islamic theology and history. In my book on the four kingdoms of Daniel I wrote that Islam will never be able to weather the critical study of its scriptures, history, and mythology like Christianity has been able to do, and I stand by that prediction because that critical study is underway despite all the efforts to prevent it. So cheer up, my friend. Things may get worse before they turn around, but turn around they will.
John S. Evans
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- by Ed on Monday, December 04 @ 19:33:48 PST
- by MiddleKnowledge on Monday, December 04 @ 20:16:56 PST
- by Ed on Monday, December 04 @ 20:27:54 PST
- by Virgil on Tuesday, December 05 @ 17:06:58 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 17:39:40 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
by valensname on Monday, December 04 @ 18:27:41 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Great article Kurt, but I'm afraid it is falling on deaf ears here on PP. Most posters seem to have the "as long as it doesn't hurt anyone" attitude when it comes to things. Nothing seems to be based on any type of moral standard, just whatever the people or a tiny minority say goes. Reminds me of the world before the flood and Judges 2:17, 21:25. We live in the promised land (new heavens and earth) but don't seem to want to do anything to serve God, except for what we want to do and allow all the foreign gods to live among us just as Israel did over and over.
Glenn |
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- by TheIdealNate on Monday, December 04 @ 18:58:39 PST
- by Starlight on Tuesday, January 09 @ 11:10:32 PST
- by valensname on Tuesday, January 09 @ 17:48:11 PST
- by Starlight on Tuesday, January 09 @ 19:54:18 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
by TheIdealNate on Monday, December 04 @ 18:52:51 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt,
In my opinion we have the problem backwards. Our law requires that we allow this Senator his wish or we have in fact endorsed a particular religion, which in the writing of most founding fathers is worse than the Koran itself.
The true problem is that America as the citizen are concerned, have left Christianity as their moral background, and therefore elected this type of Senator in office.
Our laws, though, require he recieve fair treatment and require we, as law abiding citizens, respect his religion.
We are a nation founded BY Christians, but we are not a "Christian" nation.
God Bless
Nate |
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- by Virgil on Monday, December 04 @ 19:44:18 PST
- by mazuur on Tuesday, December 05 @ 13:49:59 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Tuesday, December 05 @ 16:27:40 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 17:08:17 PST
- by MiddleKnowledge on Monday, December 04 @ 20:11:45 PST
- by TheIdealNate on Tuesday, December 05 @ 08:36:51 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Monday, December 04 @ 20:36:07 PST
- by TheIdealNate on Tuesday, December 05 @ 08:17:32 PST
- by mazuur on Tuesday, December 05 @ 12:34:56 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
 by Ed on Monday, December 04 @ 19:28:26 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt, I've tried three times now to post something that wouldn't get me banned from this site (what does that matter though since I haven't been here in so long), and hopefully I will keep my head here.
1500 years of Christian civilization is on the brink of extinction here. Christendom is waning. And far too many Preterists are cheering it on.
On this site we see a large number of Preterists who can only see the evil in Western Civiliation. In spite of the fact that in other parts of the world, darkness reigns, America and its forebearers (Europe) are considered evil. In spite of the fact that in nations around the world, children die of diseases that Western Civilization has mastered, and that same America sends medical supplies to combat (free of charge I might add), all we see from these nay-sayers (I want to use stronger language, but...) is how evil we are for trying to impose "democracy" on poor little old Iraq. We all know they had it so good before us bad old Westerners took away their toys (like wood choppers and rape rooms).
You see, Preterism suffers from the same disease of ignorance that the rest of Western Civilization in this "information age" suffers from. The internet allows Useful Idiots to come on the blogosphere and tell us how Western Civilization just happened to spring up irrespective of religious values. It was those smart old white dudes from Europe who, through philosophy, figured this all out.
We all know that the bible had nothing to do with the Culture of the West, don't we? I mean, who needs God when you have white men to figure it out.
I hope my sarcasm is noted here.
God has always used nations and peoples to smash other nations and peoples (I know that's a stretch for a lot of folks around here, due to their ignorance). Cannibals and savages on this continent were beaten militarily before being presented with the Gospel and "civilized." And yet, we are demonized for that too. We took away their religion after all - and this accusation comes from Preterists.
David Yeagley, direct descendent of Bad Eagle, one of the first great Comanche Warriors to convert to Christianity, has much to say about the defeat of the Indian nations by the White Christians. And none of it is bad. Check out www.badeagle.com if you want a real perspective on the issue.
But now it is OUR TURN. Just like the 7 churches of Revelation had their lampstands removed, the Church in America is about to lose hers. And too many Preterists are gleeful about it. That's what is really sad.
But, now I'll be accused of idolatry, of inflammatory rhetoric, of being unloving, etc., etc. But it will be by some of the most unloving, self-righteous, hypocrites I know. So I'll sleep tonight, for now. I pray for my children though. I don't know how long we will be safe.
The war will end soon. And it will follow us home. And when America falls - Australia and the rest of the whiners will be next. Mark my words. Just as Islam did in the Middle East, destroying Eastern Orthodoxy for centuries, it will do it in the West as well. Especially now that the West is being run by cowards and imbeciles (and I'm not talking about Bush here).
ed
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- by Islamaphobe on Monday, December 04 @ 20:56:04 PST
- by EWMI on Tuesday, December 05 @ 02:32:14 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 05:46:23 PST
- by EWMI on Tuesday, December 05 @ 11:34:01 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 14:16:38 PST
- by EWMI on Tuesday, December 05 @ 20:27:44 PST
- by plymouthrock on Tuesday, December 05 @ 23:54:25 PST
The Enemy Is Not Islam (Score: 1)
by EWMI on Monday, December 04 @ 20:30:19 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Yes Western Civilisation is being "white-anted" yes we are on the brink of war with yet another Islamic state. The enemies of Western Civilisation are not external they are internal. There is a major war being fomented, the war we are seeing is yet another phoney unnecessary war between the west and Iran along with whoever our and their leaders have determined will join that side. Accompanying the war to come will be economic upheaval and global unrest. Americans need to realise the even members of Congress are talking about instilling the "Amero" in place of the USD. As Ed says: "We need to prepare our children"
Don't be so naive as to think that vast immigration from Islamic countries has been accidental or just the work of liberals. Nor be so naive as to think that nation states will remain as they are. Neither allow yourselves to think that war against Afghanistan and Iraq and Iran, Syria etc are recent innovations. The plans for these conflicts and the pretexts that launched them have been cooked with cooperation from both sides for decades.
This is the war we are being geared to fight:
Zohar Torah portion of Va'era page 32a
In the future the children of Yishmael [Arabs] will stir great wars in the world. And the children of Edom [the West] will gather against them, and make war with them, one on the sea, and one on the land, and one by Jerusalem; and each one will prevail over the other but the Holy land will not fall to the hands of Edom. At the same time, a nation from the end of the world will be awakened against wicked Rome.(Rome here is said to refer to the spiritual center of western civilization) and it will make war against her for three months, and many nations will gather there, and they will fall by her hand, until all the children of Edom will gather against her from all corners of the earth. And then G-d will awaken Himself against them, as it says, "a sacrificial slaughter for the Lord in Batzra", and it says, "to shake the corners of the Land". And after this, the children of Yishmael will be finished from the world. And all the supernal powers of the nations will be broken, and no power will remain above except for the power of Israel alone.
God Help Us All |
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- by Ed on Monday, December 04 @ 21:05:07 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Monday, December 04 @ 21:05:49 PST
- by EWMI on Monday, December 04 @ 22:26:39 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Tuesday, December 05 @ 06:34:22 PST
- by EWMI on Tuesday, December 05 @ 11:40:33 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Tuesday, December 05 @ 16:23:25 PST
- by EWMI on Tuesday, December 05 @ 18:56:45 PST
- by EWMI on Thursday, December 07 @ 12:51:06 PST
- by Islamaphobe on Thursday, December 07 @ 17:22:16 PST
- by EWMI on Thursday, December 07 @ 18:31:59 PST
- by Starlight on Thursday, December 07 @ 18:33:50 PST
- by EWMI on Thursday, December 07 @ 20:54:38 PST
- by EWMI on Friday, December 08 @ 13:04:11 PST
- by Starlight on Friday, December 08 @ 20:52:40 PST
- by EWMI on Friday, December 08 @ 21:03:27 PST
- by Starlight on Saturday, December 09 @ 07:30:27 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
by mazuur on Tuesday, December 05 @ 07:32:45 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Amen Kurt! But as you can read, today's Christian correctness, disagrees, so I am afraid you are speaking to deaf ears.
What will take to "to stir us up to action or even to arms"? I am afraid it won't happen until Islam has already consumed America, and people are faced with either convert or die by the sword. Until then you'll hear nothing but rhetoric about how American wasn't really founded on the Bible and Christian principals, and we have no right to expect our country to be founded upon it, and for our laws to be upon such foundation. And we certainly have no right to educate our children about Christianity (not require them to be a Christian, just to teach them Christianity. And yes the right not to teach our children about Islam). You'll also continue hearing the Founding Fathers words reinterpreted to mean things 180 degrees from what they meant.
Perfect example is the Constitution. We constantly hear about the separation of Church as State. The problem (besides that not being in the Constitution) is the entire context surrounding the 1st Amendment and that statement from Jefferson's letter. The Fathers had no intention of the Constitution not allowing the establishment of Christianity. What they did object to was for any certain Christian *denomination* to be the Country's established religion. That the Country's established religion was Christianity was a given. Who's denomination would be the one established was what the people were worry about back then and were afraid of. That was the motivation for this statement, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion...", which comes from the 1st amendment.
Islam has no place in American government. Yes American will never require one to be a Christian, but that has nothing to do with having to follow it laws. You may disagree with Polygamy being against the law in America, but you certainly are not free to practice it. You may chose to be a Muslim in America, but you, by your chose to live here, will have to have your Children educated about such things (not require them to be one) and you will have to follow Christian based laws (thou shall not murder).
Yeah, I know. Let the bashing begin.
Rich |
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- by TheIdealNate on Tuesday, December 05 @ 08:40:08 PST
- by mazuur on Tuesday, December 05 @ 11:19:17 PST
- by TheIdealNate on Tuesday, December 05 @ 11:48:24 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
by Starlight on Tuesday, December 05 @ 08:38:08 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Guys,
I agree, could someone please find a rope and a good tree and lets stringem all up.
Reading this post and some of the responses reminds me of an episode of Gunsmoke a while back. All the important towns’ folk were in Miss Kitty’s bar discussing what needed to be done to that stranger in town who surely was the murderer which was the cause of all of Dodge City’s problems. Pretty soon after whipping themselves up into a frenzy they went and took matters into their own hands and proceeded to string the stranger up. But luckily for the stranger Matt arrived just in the nick of time to restore order to the Dodge City universe.
Just a quip folks but do you really believe that the Lord is going to go to all the trouble of coming to this earth and sacrificing himself and establish the new Heavens and Earth and then leave Dodge. God has shown his hand of intervention constantly throughout the last two millenniums. I don’t believe he is going to leave us to the Islamic without having something to say. Otherwise we just as well revert back to Partial Preterism and hope for the end of the world instead.
I know that many of us would like America to be the New Israel but God is already at work in many parts of the world, South America, Africa, India, and China rising up new generations for His Glory. And yes we have been instrumental in this process and will continue to do so. Many are not aware of what is happening in China at the moment and within a generation or two it may be the new Mongol Horde that is Gods instrument against false gods. I can only speculate and will trust his sovereign ways.
Blessing
Norm
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- by MiddleKnowledge on Tuesday, December 05 @ 09:35:46 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 14:20:32 PST
- by Starlight on Tuesday, December 05 @ 16:36:12 PST
- by Ed on Tuesday, December 05 @ 17:22:53 PST
- by Starlight on Tuesday, December 05 @ 21:44:05 PST
Re: Exiles in Our Own Land (Score: 1)
by Starlight on Thursday, December 07 @ 07:06:34 PST
(User Info | Send a Message) | Kurt,
Your observation has been raised in many other forums on the net. I did find this excerpt about the constitution which seems to lay our discussion to bed in a legal manner.
Article 6 of the constitution
Quote
“The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.”
According to our secular constitution we cannot forbid the gentleman from practicing his religion in his affirmation or oath. But of course we are “free” to discourse extensively upon this mans actions as an American elected official with all vigor and clarity of our opinions. In fact the wording seems to indicate a possible accommodation to those religious citizens of the time who did not believe in “oaths” and presents the opportunity for affirmation instead which appears to open the door to atheist and such by our framers.
Norm
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