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Did you know that from the beginning of time the whole purpose of God was to reproduce Himself?...And when we stand up here, brother, you're not looking at Morris Cerullo; you're looking at God. You're looking at Jesus
-- Morris Cerullo, "The End Time Manifestation of the Sons of God"
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For Our Posterity
Posted on Tuesday, October 03 @ 08:59:35 PDT by Valensname |
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The fulfilled eschatology worldview offers the best hope and outlook for humanity than futuristic eschatology and atheistic science theories. Preterists don’t believe the Bible talks about the end of time or the end of the Heavens and the Earth (i.e., the Universe). [1] Thus we believe the kingdom, the new covenant world has no end nor is there an end to the increase of it. Thus it appears that humanity is here to stay forever. In my present understanding the Bible implies that people will continue to be born, live, and die continually for generation to generation.
Futuristic eschatology either believes that this present universe will someday be burned up and be no more or that it will somehow be changed to a paradise where people are incapable of sinning, live physically forever, and that animals no longer eat each other. While the popular version of the big bang teaches that the universe will expand forever and eventually run out of usable energy. Thus the universe will have a heat death forever or be exceedingly cold. Either of these views presents some type of bleak outlook for the Earth and for men and women.
The accomplished salvation worldview reaffirms God’s command that we be good stewards of this creation, not pack it in and wait for it to all be burned up. Thus what do we as covenant eschatology holders offer for our world today and our posterity for tomorrow?
My hope in writing this brief article is to encourage discussion of what we, as all things fulfilled holders have to offer to our world in terms of good stewardship, hope, joy, etc... and a positive outlook for tomorrow. Also I am interested in hearing other views/understanding of how our current scientific understanding of the universe (i.e., Is the theory that the sun will burn up the earth valid?) ties in or not with the teaching that the Bible is silent regarding its future or that time has any end. [2]
Our theological worldview should be the brightest light out there. How can we help make it so?
Glenn
[1] The phrase “the heavens and the earth” almost certainly is an expression (known as a merism) signifying the totality of creation. The Hebrews didn’t have a word as we in English do for the Universe. This was the typical way for Hebrews to refer to all that there is.
[2] I am working under the assumption that most preterists believe that the Bible doesn’t speak of the end of time but the time of the end and that the Bible speaks about the end of the old covenant heavens and earth and not the end of the physical Heavens and Earth.
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Re: For Our Posterity (Score: 1)
 by Virgil on Tuesday, October 03 @ 10:53:32 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Our theological worldview should be the brightest light out there. How can we help make it so?
By accepting and promoting God's unconditional love for and to all mankind. A bright future cannot be built by telling people God hates them and that at any moment God is ready to wipe us out of existence.
Those are important and powerful thoughts Glenn! |
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Re: For Our Posterity (Score: 1)
 by Starlight on Tuesday, October 03 @ 12:11:03 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Glenn,
Is it possible to be optimistic and pessimistic at the same time?
Each one of us may take hold of that glorious rescue from eternal death but can we offer the same hope for our good earth?
As you well pointed out we live on an enduring physical earth; but with qualifications. And what are these qualifications; are there not 2000 years of wars that we have endured, and with the history of the last century we now have the potential for destruction on a world wide holocaust basis. We may be in the early throes of a possible civilizational war already.
We have the possibility of global warming which whether man induced or by natural causes can possibly raise our shore lines drastically causing potential loss of habitat and the relocation of billions of coastal populations. We have population issues as well; according to some articles out there we may reach our peak population in the next 50 to 100 years and start a downward irreversible population decline. I’ve read some reports that in less than 200 years that China could conceivably have a population similar to the United States has now. This is already a demographic reality in European countries as well as Japan.
What about the possibility of something like bird flu that produces a catastrophic world wide plague epidemic that catches us off guard with out protection and decimates us.
Remember 9/11 and the economic fall out from just two buildings being destroyed and less than 3000 souls perishing. How susceptible are we to an economic dilemma that renders our world economic system a disaster and causes mass starvation.
Theoretically speaking is there any reason to assume earths impending demise whether it be hundreds of thousands of years away or close at hand as counter to Gods Plan? After all is He not the Potter and we are the clay. Is it not his good pleasure to do as he wills even in the new heavens and earth? Would it change anything for us as eternal beings? We all believe that there was a time before this when we and the earth were not. In fact there was a time when I was not, but then I was brought into this world by birth. If this planet grows dark and cold with out form or life it will be of no consequences to you and me. We and all believers will be warm and cozy living with God. Whether he chooses to continue to breathe the breath of life into man is as abstract an idea as the idea before he chose to breathe life into Adam (speaking metaphorically of course):-)
Just some random thoughts.
Blessings
Norm
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- by valensname on Tuesday, October 03 @ 19:00:44 PDT
- by Starlight on Tuesday, October 03 @ 20:32:57 PDT
Re: For Our Posterity (Score: 1)
by paul (freebird@comcast.net) on Tuesday, October 03 @ 12:38:14 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Dear Glenn,
Thanks for the challenge to translate fulfilled truth into "hands-on" changes!!!
We can only start where we live, hoping and working to be used of God to bring greater awareness of His glorious kingdom reign, made real through the human activities of our own individual calling in life, so that the will of God is done on earth, as it is in heaven.
You're making me think, Bro!
paul richard strange, sr. |
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Re: For Our Posterity (Score: 1)
by rfwitt (hifive@att.net) on Tuesday, October 03 @ 14:26:29 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | I believe that not all prochecy has been fullfilled and I believe that future generations will see the Lords Word fullfilled.
Richard Wittemann...........
"Isa 2:1 The Word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
Isa 2:2 And it shall be, in the last days the mountain of Jehovah's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow into it.
Isa 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come, and let us go to the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob. And He will teach us of His ways, and we will walk in His paths. For out of Zion shall go out the Law, and the Word of Jehovah from Jerusalem.
Isa 2:4 And He shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning-hooks. Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.
Isa 2:5 O house of Jacob, come and let us walk in the light of Jehovah."
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- by valensname on Tuesday, October 03 @ 19:03:28 PDT
- by rfwitt on Wednesday, October 04 @ 04:09:10 PDT
- by valensname on Wednesday, October 04 @ 09:06:31 PDT
Re: Not All Preterists Believe That The Earth Or Humanity Is Eternal (Score: 1)
 by chrisliv on Tuesday, October 03 @ 16:09:49 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Well,
The Preterist position is certainly more optimistic than Dispensationalism.
We don't see the end of the world coming with every Israeli tank movement. And we're not looking for signs of another Antichrist or for a cube-shaped New Jerusalem to drop out of the sky.
No, those things have all been literally fulfilled either in the physical sense or in the dimension of the Holy Spirit, for those who believe.
But, I don't think the Preterist position must include the idea of an eternal earth or the ongoing existence of humanity forever. I know that there are some places where the Bible may speak of hills as being eternal. But those are relative terms, I think. Hills as constantly being leveled with earth movers, and they are occasionally being brought forth by volcanic activity.
Preterists should not be so silly as to think that a hostile World System could not make our planet a pretty miserable place beyond what it has in the 20th Century.
Washington DC was been bombing Iraqis and Afganis with munitions that contain depleted uranium (DU) for a long time. It used them in the Balkans, too. And it has supplied the Israeli State with depleted uranium munitions for their use on Arabs as early as their 1967 War.
Depleted uranium munitions burn through armor and turn into a fine dust. These particles have a half-life of around 4.5 billion years and have now been detected in the Himalayas and Hawaii.
Depleted uranium particles that get into the lungs of anybody can be passed to a spouse through semen, and can also cause defects or cancer to potential children.
As Soldier Daddy comes home from Iraq, he may have brought something with him that will visit his wife and children for 3 or 4 generations.
So, the Preterist should not be so silly as to think that they, too, should not reap what they sow, or that planet Earth could not become a place of terrible misery, even in North America.
The State is more than obsolete; it's hostile and destructive to any people.
Peace to you all,
C. Livingstone
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- by EWMI on Tuesday, October 03 @ 16:25:18 PDT
- by JL on Tuesday, October 03 @ 17:30:29 PDT
- by EWMI on Tuesday, October 03 @ 17:33:14 PDT
- by valensname on Tuesday, October 03 @ 19:18:45 PDT
- by Starlight on Tuesday, October 03 @ 20:26:42 PDT
- by valensname on Tuesday, October 03 @ 21:10:14 PDT
- by Starlight on Wednesday, October 04 @ 11:20:21 PDT
- by valensname on Wednesday, October 04 @ 12:27:31 PDT
- by Starlight on Thursday, October 05 @ 06:35:41 PDT
- by valensname on Thursday, October 05 @ 09:16:16 PDT
- by chrisliv on Tuesday, October 03 @ 22:14:26 PDT
- by valensname on Wednesday, October 04 @ 09:28:03 PDT
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, October 04 @ 10:50:50 PDT
- by valensname on Wednesday, October 04 @ 20:01:42 PDT
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, October 04 @ 11:50:31 PDT
- by MiddleKnowledge on Wednesday, October 04 @ 17:53:24 PDT
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, October 04 @ 20:09:27 PDT
- by MiddleKnowledge on Thursday, October 05 @ 06:15:49 PDT
- by valensname on Thursday, October 05 @ 09:32:59 PDT
- by MiddleKnowledge on Thursday, October 05 @ 16:23:12 PDT
- by valensname on Thursday, October 05 @ 16:55:22 PDT
- by chrisliv on Thursday, October 05 @ 10:45:19 PDT
- by MiddleKnowledge on Thursday, October 05 @ 16:25:53 PDT
- by chrisliv on Thursday, October 05 @ 17:52:39 PDT
The Problem of a Provincial Faith (Score: 1)
 by Windpressor (Giddi_one) on Friday, October 06 @ 01:01:54 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | *****************
Even if one concedes that the Hebrew for "sky" and "land" serves as placeholder for the MEST universe, there is an inherent problem with the parochial nature of the overall scriptural account. The Bible doesn't inform about western continents, indigenous cultures, expanding space vacuum, glacial ice layers and a host of other matters of a global reality. To me, credibility suffers under the exegetical stretch of globalized interpretation as justification for universal application where the hermeneutic is clearly regional. Tim and others have no doubt elucidated on the use of "earth" and other terms in a regional worldview. I note only one here for example:
Revelation 18
24"And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints,
and of all who have been slain on earth."
All dead on the globe end up in Judeo-Babylon?? I suppose ... a doctrine could be derived ...
If preterism as a "worldview offers the best hope and outlook for humanity", then it needs to have a solid credibility that does not cringe from an honest look at the provincial Judeo-Roman audience relevance. We can not return Galileo's genie back into the geocentric bottle. I want to give an answer about how the revelation of God to man is confined to the Jewish hegemony without retreat to the characteristic disclaimer -- to disregard "that man behind the curtain". [Some might claim that we should give obeisance to a man that wears a curtain :)]
I am a bit fuzzy on my world and Church history. Was it not during the 15th and 16th century when global navigation, heliocentrism, hemispherical indigenous encounters challenged the ecclesiastical Eurocentric worldview? The age of exploration and enlightenment was a crisis for the Christian faith was it not? I would like to read a good overview that objectively deals with the conflicts of that era. My impression, from anecdotal allusions, is that the prevailing mindset was one of denial which eventually erupted into various divisive doctrinairisms. One attempt to assuage discrepancies was Joseph Smith's magical history for a native population. Skeptics and secularists offer the cold shoulder of incredulity when apologetics can't withstand scrutiny any better than popularized or cultic nonsence.
Audience relevance is local. If we are to shine preterism as the "brightest light out there", we will do it best by acknowledging the mustard seed planted as a provincial faith was grown to, not blown out of, global proportions.
G1
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- by valensname on Friday, October 06 @ 10:40:28 PDT
- by Windpressor on Saturday, October 07 @ 03:14:47 PDT
- by valensname on Saturday, October 07 @ 10:25:45 PDT
- by Windpressor on Monday, October 09 @ 02:54:20 PDT
- by valensname on Monday, October 09 @ 16:16:51 PDT
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