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"I have had my physical appearance duplicated by demons."
-- Bob Larson
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News: Where are the Christians?
Posted on Thursday, July 20 @ 07:27:49 PDT by John |
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by Pat Buchanan
When Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert unleashed his navy and air force on Lebanon, accusing that tiny nation of an "act of war," the last pillar of Bush's Middle East policy collapsed. First came capitulation on the Bush Doctrine, as Pyongyang and Tehran defied Bush's dictum: The world's worst regimes will not be allowed to acquire the world's worst weapons. Then came suspension of the democracy crusade as Islamic militants exploited free elections to advance to power and office in Egypt, Lebanon, Gaza, the West Bank, Iraq and Iran.
Now, Israel's rampage against a defenseless Lebanon – smashing airport runways, fuel tanks, power plants, gas stations, lighthouses, bridges, roads and the occasional refugee convoy – has exposed Bush's folly in subcontracting U.S. policy out to Tel Aviv, thus making Israel the custodian of our reputation and interests in the Middle East.
The Lebanon that Israel, with Bush's blessing, is smashing up has a pro-American government, heretofore considered a shining example of his democracy crusade. Yet, asked in St. Petersburg if he would urge Israel to use restraint in its airstrikes, Bush sounded less like the leader of the Free World than some bellicose city councilman from Brooklyn Heights.
What Israel is up to was described by its army chief of staff, Lt. Gen. Dan Halutz, when he threatened to "turn back the clock in Lebanon 20 years."
Olmert seized upon Hezbollah's capture of two Israeli soldiers to unleash the IDF in a pre-planned attack to make the Lebanese people suffer until the Lebanese government disarms Hezbollah, a task the Israeli army could not accomplish in 18 years of occupation.
Israel is doing the same to the Palestinians. To punish these people for the crime of electing Hamas, Olmert imposed an economic blockade of Gaza and the West Bank and withheld the $50 million in monthly tax and customs receipts due the Palestinians.
Then, Israel instructed the United States to terminate all aid to the Palestinian Authority, though Bush himself had called for the elections and for the participation of Hamas. Our Crawford cowboy meekly complied.
The predictable result: Fatah and Hamas fell to fratricidal fighting, and Hamas militants began launching Qassam rockets over the fence from Gaza into Israel. Hamas then tunneled into Israel, killed two soldiers, captured one, took him back into Gaza and demanded a prisoner exchange.
Israel's response was to abduct half of the Palestinian cabinet and parliament and blow up a $50 million U.S.-insured power plant. That cut off electricity for half a million Palestinians. Their food spoiled, their water could not be purified, and their families sweltered in the summer heat of the Gaza desert. One family of seven was wiped out on a beach by what the IDF assures us was an errant artillery shell.
Let it be said: Israel has a right to defend herself, a right to counter-attack against Hezbollah and Hamas, a right to clean out bases from which Katyusha or Qassam rockets are being fired and a right to occupy land from which attacks are mounted on her people.
But what Israel is doing is imposing deliberate suffering on civilians, collective punishment on innocent people, to force them to do something they are powerless to do: disarm the gunmen among them. Such a policy violates international law and comports neither with our values nor our interests. It is un-American and un-Christian.
But where are the Christians? Why is Pope Benedict virtually alone among Christian leaders to have spoken out against what is being done to Lebanese Christians and Muslims?
When al-Qaida captured two U.S. soldiers and barbarically butchered them, the U.S. Army did not smash power plants across the Sunni Triangle. Why then is Bush not only silent but openly supportive when Israelis do this?
Democrats attack Bush for crimes of which he is not guilty, including Haditha and Abu Ghraib. Why are they, too, silent when Israel pursues a conscious policy of collective punishment of innocent peoples?
Britain's diplomatic goal in two world wars was to bring the naive cousins in, to "pull their chestnuts out of the fire." Israel and her paid and pro-bono agents here appear determined to expand the Iraq war into Syria and Iran, and have America fight and finish all of Israel's enemies.
That Tel Aviv is maneuvering us to fight its wars is understandable. That Americans are ignorant of, or complicit in this, is deplorable.
Already, Bush is ranting about Syria being behind the Hezbollah capture of the Israeli soldiers. But where is the proof?
Who is whispering in his ear? The same people who told him Iraq was maybe months away from an atom bomb, that an invasion would be a "cakewalk," that he would be Churchill, that U.S. troops would be greeted with candy and flowers, that democracy would break out across the region, that Palestinians and Israelis would then sit down and make peace?
How much must America pay for the education of this man?
From: http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=51116
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Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
 by paul (freebird@comcast.net) on Thursday, July 20 @ 12:07:15 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | At the risk of giving away too much, I voted for Pat in 1996
paul |
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- by Virgil on Thursday, July 20 @ 14:29:38 PDT
- by Islamaphobe on Thursday, July 20 @ 18:18:30 PDT
Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
 by davo on Thursday, July 20 @ 21:19:32 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) |
But what Israel is doing is imposing deliberate suffering on civilians, collective punishment on innocent people, to force them to do something they are powerless to do: disarm the gunmen among them. Such a policy violates international law and comports neither with our values nor our interests. It is un-American and un-Christian. ...
That Tel Aviv is maneuvering us to fight its wars is understandable. That Americans are ignorant of, or complicit in this, is deplorable. hmm, interesting.
How much must America pay for the education of this man? That might depend, he was the one who said: "...and for all you 'C grade' students -- you too can be president". |
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Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
by EWMI on Thursday, July 20 @ 21:45:46 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Pat is right on the money here. What we are hearing is that the current action is propelling Arabs all over the world into radicalism. I am shocked that there seems to be so little concern that about one third of the deaths in Lebanon are children. I am also in wonderment that people seem to accept that the bombing of churches and food outlets is somehow acceptable. Recently, I heard a Lebanese Orthodox man call talkback radio. He mentioned a church in a Southern Lebanese town (he mentioned the town as well). His children were visiting there at the time. The town got the "Leave now" fliers that were dropped from the air. The citizens mostly Christians BTW, were faced with the prospect of trying to leave on roads that had been bombed (read closed). The people decided to congregate in the local Lebanese Orthodox church. The church was directly hit. Two children and three adults died and twenty five were wounded. Christians -5 Hezbollah -0.
Where are the Christians? |
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- by EWMI on Thursday, July 20 @ 22:26:07 PDT
RE: The Real Aim by Uri Avnery (Score: 1)
 by Windpressor (Giddi_one) on Thursday, July 20 @ 23:39:24 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | *********
Just browsing and found an interesting take:
The Real Aim by Uri Avnery --
___________
"THE REAL aim is to change the regime in Lebanon and to install a puppet government.
That was the aim of Ariel Sharon's invasion of Lebanon in 1982. It failed. But Sharon and his pupils in the military and political leadership have never really given up on it.
As in 1982, the present operation, too, was planned and is being carried out in full coordination with the U.S.
As then, there is no doubt that it is coordinated with a part of the Lebanese elite.
That's the main thing.
Everything else is noise and propaganda.
ON THE eve of the 1982 invasion, Secretary of State Alexander Haig told Ariel Sharon that, before starting it, it was necessary to have a "clear provocation," which would be accepted by the world.
The provocation indeed took place--exactly at the appropriate time-- ..." Avnery article July 21, 2006
---------------
G1
........... |
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- by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 00:11:07 PDT
Re: Where are the Christians? Were They Committing Atrocities In Sabra And Shatila? (Score: 1)
 by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 00:14:18 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Yeah,
The targeting by the Israelis and bombing of Christian, Lebanese neighborhoods may be a strategy to incite them against against the Shiite Hezbollah.
I believe some of the so-called Christian Phalangists of Lebanon were trained by Israelis, and did the mass-murder for the Israelis, who protected and provided indirect assistance to them as they committed those atrocities in the Palestinian refugee camps Sabra and Shatila in 1982.
So, it seems perfectly consistent that the Israelis would bomb "Christian" Lebanese civilian populations to incite them into another sectarian civil war against Hezbollah, since there is no majority sect of 50% there.
For those not familiar with Sabra and Shatila, I'll post an exerpt and a URL below.
Peace to you all,
C. Livingstone
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http://www.geocities.com/cahumanity/
...The Sabra and Shatila neighborhoods were originally set aside for Palestinian refugee camps many years before. By 1982 Sabra and Shatila had developed into full neighborhoods of Beirut with both Palestinian refugees and Lebanese living in there.
Survivors had to be held back so they did not touch the victims when they found the remains of their children, parents, grandparents and friends from this atrocity - many of the victims were booby trapped to kill more people.
Doctors and nurses (Palestinian and Lebanese) at the Akka Hospital were killed. The Akka Hospital is across the street from the entrance of the Sabra and Shatila neighborhoods. American, European, Asian and other staff at the Gaza Hospital inside the Sabra and Shatila neighborhood were rounded up at gunpoint towards the end of the slaughter (Newsweek October 4, 1982).
The Gaza Hospital staff expected to suffered the same fate as many of the people living in Sabra and Shatila. Some of the aid workers felt they would be raped before being killed. Instead the Israeli military in the area issued orders and the aid workers, after interrogation were to be let go. No doubt, in many people's minds the Israeli military could have issued orders to insure these crimes against humanity against the people in Sabra and Shatila did not take place. Those were not the orders issued.
The aid workers reported that the Israeli's surrounded Sabra and Shatila, refusing to allow anyone out. During the two nights the night sky was lit up by Israeli flares from nearby and planes overhead allowing the killings to more easily take place.
Ariel Sharon was in charge of the Israeli forces surrounding the camps and was near by while the atrocities were taking place. After more than 400,000 Israelis demonstrated against Israel's involvement in the massacre the Kahan commission was established by Israel. The Kahan Commission headed by the Chief Justice of Israel's Supreme Court found in their Kahan Commission Report, among other issues, Ariel Sharon responsible for "ignoring the danger of bloodshed and revenge when he approved the entry of the Phalangists into the camps as well as not taking appropriate measures to prevent bloodshed." See the table of contents for more details...
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Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
by Islamaphobe on Friday, July 21 @ 07:19:11 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Seeing all the enthusiasm for Pat's views posted here, I shall briefly comment. As I noted in my response to Paul, I have been following Buchanan for many years and have never found in him any evidence of having studied Islamic theology and history for more than five minutes. Now I do believe that some of the anti-Israel posters here are a little more familiar with Islam than Pat is, but the general thrust of their comments is to focus on the sins of the Jews and to ignore, and I mean ignore, the theology and actions of Hezbollah, Hamas, etc., and to treat Iran as responding to American aggression. After all, it's all about oil, isn't it? We are currently witnessing the unfolding of a war between militant Islamists--who are simply preaching ORTHODOX Islam (Sunni and Shi'a versions)--against the rest of the world, but you would never know it from most of the posts that appear here. Bye,
John S. Evans |
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- by Islamaphobe on Friday, July 21 @ 10:25:42 PDT
- by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 14:14:09 PDT
Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
by Parker on Friday, July 21 @ 10:55:38 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Lebanon has a huge Christian population which is not responsible for any of Israel's woes. It is unseemly for Israel to invade Lebanon in response to recent events.
Hezbollah is a big problem in Lebanon, but a better way to deal with them might be to work with the Lebanese people to root them out. Many innocent Christians will die if Israel launches an all out war on the entire country. That is what Buchanan is responding to. Furthermore, Buchanan notes that this is not America's war. So why are the Neocons and Zionist Dispensationalists in America talking about getting involved? I suspect it is partly because of their false endtimes theology.
I'd like to read some answers here to Buchanan's newest article:
No, this is not 'our war'
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=51164 |
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- by Islamaphobe on Friday, July 21 @ 13:44:03 PDT
- by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 14:29:40 PDT
- by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 14:50:55 PDT
Evangelical Blindness on Lebanon? (Score: 1)
by Parker on Friday, July 21 @ 11:01:09 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Another interesting article. Any comments?
Evangelical Blindness on Lebanon
http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2006/129/42.0.html |
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Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
by chrisliv on Friday, July 21 @ 19:57:18 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Yeah,
Here's another exerpt from an article with a couple of salient points.
Peace to you all,
C. Livingstone
------------------------------------------------------
...From these resistance organizations, Israel kidnapped and detained many. An exchange between Israel and Hezbollah itself led to the release of hundreds (not all) of POWs for the bodies of 3 Israeli soldiers. (Thus, the Israeli foreign minister’s recent statement that Israel has not [in the past] negotiated with Hezbollah is a simple historical lie.)
Labeled ‘POWs,’ Lebanese continue to be held in Israel, some for no less than 20 years. Lebanon’s government had demanded hundreds of times for their release – and the response, from Israel, the US, and the international community, has been an empty echo.
Who has been successful in the release of Lebanese prisoners – without waging war? Hezbollah.
George Bush has said that a country has a right to defend itself.
Yes. But Israel is not defending itself.
Israel began this war. It began it with the attacks on civilians.
This war is consistent with previous Israeli policies of aggression. In 1993, for example, [former Israeli Prime Minister] Barak conducted a war specifically based on the bombardment of civilians, according to Sagi, former Israeli military intelligence chief. Same policy in the 1996 attacks on Lebanon’s civilians. And before that in 1982. …
So, if I slap you, will you burn my family? Yes – if you want to burn my family from the start.
Yes, so long as the US is silent.
Remember: in the Israeli invasion of 1978, Jimmy Carter succeeded to halt Israel’s war on Lebanon by threatening the enactment of the US Arms Export Control Act, prohibiting the use of US-supplied military weaponry on civilian targets.
Rania Masri is a Lebanese-American professor in Lebanon, www.siegeoflebanon.blogspot.com |
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Re: Where are the Christians? (Score: 1)
by Islamaphobe on Saturday, July 22 @ 07:22:43 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | | For anyone interested in reading another viewpoint from the dominant one expressed here and learning something about twelfth Iman theology as it relates to the War we are in, go to iraqthemodel.com for the posting of July 19. |
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'Civilian Casualty'? It Depends (Score: 1)
by EWMI on Sunday, July 23 @ 00:12:38 PDT
(User Info | Send a Message) | Alan Dershowitz helps us understand the Israeli reasons for obliterating entire populations. It seems, according to him, that all a person needs to do to get carpet-bombed is smile at someone who at some time will join a political group that may one day be classed as terrorist. His article makes interesting if now sobering reading:
Those who supports terrorists are not entirely innocent.
By Alan Dershowitz
ALAN DERSHOWITZ is a professor of law at Harvard. He is the author, most recently, of "Preemption: A Knife that Cuts Both Ways."
July 22, 2006
THE NEWS IS filled these days with reports of civilian casualties, comparative civilian body counts and criticism of Israel, along with Hezbollah, for causing the deaths, injuries and "collective punishment" of civilians. But just who is a "civilian" in the age of terrorism, when militants don't wear uniforms, don't belong to regular armies and easily blend into civilian populations?
We need a new vocabulary to reflect the realities of modern warfare. A new phrase should be introduced into the reporting and analysis of current events in the Middle East: "the continuum of civilianality." Though cumbersome, this concept aptly captures the reality and nuance of warfare today and provides a more fair way to describe those who are killed, wounded and punished.
There is a vast difference — both moral and legal — between a 2-year-old who is killed by an enemy rocket and a 30-year-old civilian who has allowed his house to be used to store Katyusha rockets. Both are technically civilians, but the former is far more innocent than the latter. There is also a difference between a civilian who merely favors or even votes for a terrorist group and one who provides financial or other material support for terrorism.
Finally, there is a difference between civilians who are held hostage against their will by terrorists who use them as involuntary human shields, and civilians who voluntarily place themselves in harm's way in order to protect terrorists from enemy fire.
These differences and others are conflated within the increasingly meaningless word "civilian" — a word that carried great significance when uniformed armies fought other uniformed armies on battlefields far from civilian population centers. Today this same word equates the truly innocent with guilty accessories to terrorism.
The domestic law of crime, in virtually every nation, reflects this continuum of culpability. For example, in the infamous Fall River rape case (fictionalized in the film "The Accused"), there were several categories of morally and legally complicit individuals: those who actually raped the woman; those who held her down; those who blocked her escape route; those who cheered and encouraged the rapists; and those who could have called the police but did not.
No rational person would suggest that any of these people were entirely free of moral guilt, although reasonable people might disagree about the legal guilt of those in the last two categories. Their accountability for rape is surely a matter of degree, as is the accountability for terrorism of those who work with the terrorists.
It will, of course, be difficult for international law — and for the media — to draw the lines of subtle distinction routinely drawn by domestic criminal law. This is because domestic law operates on a retail basis — one person and one case at a time. International law and media reporting about terrorism tend to operate on more of a wholesale basis — with body counts, civilian neighborhoods and claims of collective punishment.
But the recognition that "civilianality" is often a matter of degree, rather than a bright line, should still inform the assessment of casualty figures in wars involving terrorists, paramilitary groups and others who fight without uniforms — or help those who fight without uniforms.
Turning specifically to the c
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- by leslie on Tuesday, July 25 @ 10:06:28 PDT
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