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Yeah, I was in Ghana just recently. We had half a million people show up, and a man was raised from the dead on the platform - that's a fact, people. -- Benny Hinn, From a CNN Impact Expose on March 16, 1997 |
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News: Preterism and the Emergent Church
Posted on Saturday, February 25 @ 06:25:01 PST by Virgil |
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A couple of days ago, Jessica from Fort Wayne posted a comment on my recent column "Emergent Musings" in which she is very well illustrating the strong ties Preterism could have with the emergent movement and thought in general. I am welcoming Jessica with open arms to Preterism and I feel very fortunate to have people like her consider the merits and values of Preterist eschatology...read her comment below.
Re: Emergent Musings
by arabella5c on Thursday, February 23 @ 18:14:42 PST
I am relatively new to both "emergent" and preteristm; however, I've finally come to the realization that like it or not I am an evangelical "postmodern" or a post-evangelical or whatever you want to call it (having also been rejected by the evangelical church partly because, try as I might, I just don't get it.)
Therefore, I have been giving these two movements a great deal of thought and have come to the conclusion that preterism is perhaps THE key to the emerging postmodern theology.
Here is why:
In my opinion the marvelous thing about postmodernism is the openness to the spiritual world. We are just barely around the corner of
this massive transition where the popular culture is seeking and beginning to explore spiritual realities. Movies like the Matrix, the CIA's Star Gate Remote Viewing program, Montel William's special guest Sylvia Brown, "psychic detectives", The Medium, Dr. Phil's recent program on demonic possession, etc. (What can I say, I'm a stay-at-home mom, I watch a lot of TV!)
People everywhere, regardless of education or status, are beginning to acknowledge that the world we see and experience everyday is in ultimate reality a SPIRITUAL world that is interacting with and manifesting itself in the physical world. This is indeed a massive cultural shift from modernity.
How, then, does preterism have a part to play in this massive cultural paradigm shift?
In my opionion, at the heart of preterism is the SPIRITUAL KINGDOM OF GOD; that is, a recognition of the spiritual world and a recognition that the spiritual world is more real than the world we see and touch. It is a recognition that human beings are spiritual beings and that salvation is a spiritual experience and that there is a spiritual "matrix" out there and that perhaps the reason much of the church has been so spiritually defeated is because we are still waiting "for Christ's second coming" and have not taken our the place of spiritual dominion that is rightfully ours as sons of God on the earth (Eph 2:6). Thus, if the world's in bad shape, we have no one to blame but ourselves. Eek!
Therefore, because preterism has at its heart the message of the spiritual kingdom of God that has invaded the earth to bring salvation, I believe it is a key to the success of the church in postmodern culture.
Once the church puts to rest the issue of the nature of the kingdom, we can begin to answer some important questions (the world, by the way, is asking and looking in all the wrong places for answers):
What does it mean that we are spiritual beings?
What are the laws of the spiritual world?
How can human beings live successfully in the spiritual world?
How can we activate our spirits so as to have full fellowship and communication with one another?
What is the relationship of spiritual healing to physical healing and spiritual health to physical health?
What is the mysterious power of prayer, words, blessings and curses?
Are human beings really somehow capable of predicting the future or seeing the past?
Shall the church leave it to Harry Potter to answer these questions for the next generation? (Borders bookstore, by the way, has an entire section devoted to witchcraft in the children's department.)
Shame on us if we, the church, choose to leave it to occult religions to answer these questions. The alternative is that we find the courage to explore the answers to these questions for ourselves and to live full spiritual lives on the earth.
I think the truth of preterism just may have the power to give us that courage.
These are just some of my ponderings. Let the kingdom come, even as it is already here.
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Re: Preterism and the Emergent Church (Score: 1)
by Islamaphobe on Saturday, February 25 @ 09:53:24 PST (User Info | Send a Message) | Jessica from Fort Wayne is on to something. She writes: "We are just barely around the corner of this massive transtion where the popular culture is seekiing and beginning to explore spiritual realities." She clearly recognizes that the moment is at hand, at last, for a huge change in the spiritual realm that may represent the greatest reformation in Christianity since the Reformation or even in its entire post-first century history. Now I know full well that many people have always tended to think that great changes in human existence would occur in their generation or generations, and I have great contempt for dispensationalism and reject other forms of futurist eschatology, but I nevertheless believe that vast changes in Christian thought and practice are occurring right now and will gain enormous momentum within the lifetimes of most visitors to this site.
To the observations that Jessica makes I add this one. I also believe that Islam has begun to implode and that the process of its implosion will soon accelerate. Just as the collapse of the Soviet Empire occurred in seemingly sudden fashion (though there were strong indicators of a coming decline to some observers), the collapse of Islam is likely to occur rather rapidly. Unfortunately, it won't go quietly. But my point is that enormous changes in religious beliefs are going to occur in the not very distant future--and don't call me a futurist!
John S. Evans |
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- by mazuur on Saturday, February 25 @ 11:24:24 PST
Re: Preterism and the Emergent Church (Score: 1)
by Reformer on Saturday, February 25 @ 10:50:28 PST (User Info | Send a Message) | With due respect for this lady and other preterists, Jesus (nor any OT or NT writer) never referred to his kingdom as a "spiritual kingdom." And, in my opinion, we'd well advised to follow Jesus' (et al.'s) lead here.
Of course, his kingdom is spiritual, but not exclusively spiritual. It has major physicality aspects associated with it as well. Words and terms are important. Therefore, I don't use this terminology. Again, in my opinion, it is not accurate or appropriate, but misleading.
BTW -- dittos for his comings!
Blessings,
John Noe |
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- by mazuur on Saturday, February 25 @ 11:18:46 PST
- by Virgil on Saturday, February 25 @ 11:43:39 PST
- by Reformer on Saturday, February 25 @ 11:59:06 PST
- by Virgil on Saturday, February 25 @ 20:07:37 PST
- by Tubbie on Saturday, February 25 @ 20:53:52 PST
- by flannery0 on Sunday, February 26 @ 04:53:33 PST
- by Ozark on Saturday, February 25 @ 16:59:34 PST
- by arabella5c on Saturday, February 25 @ 20:02:26 PST
- by MiddleKnowledge on Saturday, February 25 @ 20:38:24 PST
- by chrisliv on Saturday, February 25 @ 22:03:21 PST
- by mrfullpreterist on Monday, February 27 @ 06:47:33 PST
Re: Preterists Who Attempt To Perform Abortions, Spiritually Speaking (Score: 1)
by chrisliv on Saturday, February 25 @ 12:50:13 PST (User Info | Send a Message) | Yeah,
Some nice thoughts and observations, by Jessica.
But, I don't think "preterism is perhaps THE key to the emerging postmodern theology."
As far as I can tell, eschatology was not even an element in these early stages of the Emergent association. They seemed to just set aside all of the pervasive Dispensational notions altogather, which is to their credit.
However, now, as a recent Brian McLaren audio interview on John Anderson's program reveals, McLaren did accept a Preterist eschatology some years ago when he was exposed to it. Emergent people, since they tend to be less rigid, may be the earliest ecclessiatical association to actually embrace a Preterist eschatology, en masse. So, as McLaren now seems more willing to express his Preterist understanding, it may become a widely accepted or preferable part of the Emergent dialogue, which is to their credit.
Sadly, a couple of Preterist proponents and websites have spread some toxic gossip that characterized Emergent thinkers as "Branch Davidians" and "Neo-Nimrodians" or as having the potential to destroy The Gospel and God's Kingdom. However, I think most Preterists realize that these beginning stages of the Emergent thinking is perhaps a bit more liberal than some demonational orientations, nothing more.
Personally, I think Emergent or any other ecclesiastical association, in order to be the Light of the World, needs to begin a dialogue on taking steps to Separate the Body of Christ from the Body of the State, which would include as an inital step, the disolving of state-incorporation by "churches" and revoking the federal 501 (c) 3 status.
Otherwise, the Emergent thinkers have correctly identified how "The Church" seems to lack The Spirit of Christ and are more receptive to seeing a form of Christianity that is more Christ-like, which is to their credit.
And, it's probably not perfectly relevant to the article, but I'd like to caution any of those Preterists who want to characterize dear ones, like Jessica here, as "Branch Davidians" or "Neo-Babelites". The Preterists that are making those kind of characterizations are attempting to perform Abortions, intellectually and spiritually speaking.
Peace to you all,
C. Livingstone
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- by Virgil on Saturday, February 25 @ 18:19:13 PST
- by MiddleKnowledge on Saturday, February 25 @ 19:53:16 PST
Re: Preterism and the Emergent Church (Score: 1)
by leslie on Monday, February 27 @ 10:34:17 PST (User Info | Send a Message) | As a 'Southern Baptist' (Preterist, NOT a-mil)I recieve a Baptist paper called 'the Pathway', here in Missouri. There was an article on several 'non-traditional' movements that should be looked at 'from afar'. ie. 'Home Churchs', used to get away from the 'mega churchs', high overhead , and missions. 'OK' as long as 'doctrine' is not 'changed'.
'Emergent Churches', should be 'shunned' as doctrines of 'hell' and other indisputable doctrines are questioned.
I had a good laugh. Sounded almost like a Preterist Church to me. So it 'may' not be all that bad on some issues if we are all Bereans.
Les |
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Re: Preterism and the Emergent Church (Score: 1)
by Kimmie on Monday, February 27 @ 11:30:24 PST (User Info | Send a Message) | | While doing some studying on the astrological climate during 70 A.D., I came across a new age article stating how the "age of Pisces" which supposedly arose during the time of Jesus was coming to an end, and that "the age of Aquarius" which was one of "enlightenment, knowledge, and personal awareness" would be taking hold on earth. (I am not a new-ager. Just someone who loves to study.) After reading Jessica's post and the comments, the article I read amused me more. Notwithstanding the article, I, too, believe the world is ready and a great deal will eagerly embrace the knowlege of the truth about the parousia! Thank you PP for your site which has helped me grow in my own personal journey over this past year. |
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- by Virgil on Monday, February 27 @ 11:49:46 PST
- by leslie on Monday, February 27 @ 13:25:39 PST
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