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God did not create the world out of nothing, He used the Force of His Faith. -- Kenneth Copeland, Spirit, Soul and Body, #01-0601, Tape #1 |
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by Samuel Frost Having traveled for the last five years to Preterist conferences (including the last two held in what was the only Preterist conference center, Warren, Ohio), I must say that Preterism is alive and well. There are contacts in Canada, Australia, and Planet Preterist has translated James Stuart Russell’s book into Romanian! Allow me to elaborate.
First, before going any further, I must define Preterism. I define it, for the sake of this article, as any and all attempts to build upon a Christian theology that asserts that Jesus’ Second Coming surrounded the events of the razing of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. This would include the works of Russell, Hampden-Cook, Terry, and John Humphrey Noyes. All of these men wrote during the nineteenth century. ‘Preterism’ as a term was also much in use among those scholars that did not see the Second Coming as occurring in C.E. 70, however. For example, F.W. Farrar uses the term to denote those who interpret John’s Apocalypse as “mainly” having to do with the destruction of Jerusalem, but not entirely, and certainly the Second Coming, Resurrection of the Dead, or the so called ‘Final Judgment’ did not occur at that time. Certainly, the step that Russell took was based on this earlier form of Preterism. Russell took the next logical leap, refusing to separate the Second Coming passages that were so bound to passages that were being interpreted as occurring in the Jewish War. From Russell we get to Philip Mauro (1911) and several others (though Mauro was not a “full” Preterist, either).
During the Liberalism vs. Fundamentalism period (roughly the 1910’s-1950’s) the Liberal schools, some of them quite preposterous, concentrated on Eschatology. Schweitzer, Dodd, Cullman, Bultmann, and others focused their efforts on locating a Jesus either devoid of eschatological speculations (Bultmann) or that he was simply a failed prophet (Schweitzer). Dodd, remaining evangelical, attempted a ‘realized eschatology’ as well as Cullman’s ‘mid-point’ eschatology. They were all trying to come to grips with the imminent statements of the gospels and epistles. On an unbiased reading of the gospel statements, Jesus clearly foresaw the restoration of Israel as something on the near horizon. Dispensationalism agreed, but postponed the event.
Most scholars today, including conservative evangelicals, are convinced that Jesus’ imminence language does indeed point to the Roman victory over the Jews, at least in some way. This is very encouraging to those of us that endorse a full-fledged Preterism (“consistent Preterism” as some call it). However, creeds die hard, and one of the main hurdles facing Preterism today is the fact that the majority of the church, in the majority of her history, has rejected any idea (or even entertained any such idea) that the Second Coming is a past event rather than a future one. I remember in my senior year at college creating quite a stir on campus (I even got called into the pastor’s office!). To even suggest that “it had all happened” meant that “nothing was left for us” today. In other words, the sheer ability to think outside a futurist framework as it relates to these things is surely the signs of a cult, or quackery.
I cut my teeth on the work of Russell. I have the first edition of the Baker Books reprint (ala Walt Hibbard). From a footnote in David Chilton’s book ‘Days of Vengeance: A Exposition on the Book of Revelation’ (Dominion Press) I found out about Max King and ‘The Cross and the Parousia of Christ,’ a mammoth volume devoted to this very issue. That was 1991. I began receiving the newsletter put out by ‘Living Presence.’ Among those authors were Jack Scott, William Bell, Larry Siegle, Doug King and a man by the name of Don Preston. Further, I contacted Ed Stevens and in Orlando, Florida, attended a conference that was immediately after the conference held by R.C. Sproul and Ligonier Ministries. At the latter conference, my instructor at Whitefield Theological Seminary, Kenneth Gentry, spoke. This was 1997, I believe. When R.C. wrote ‘The Last Days According to Jesus,’ the Preterist landslide began to take place.
R.C. had engaged in a lengthy conversation with Max King and comments on his work quite a bit in his book. There was a closed meeting between Max and Tim King, R.C., Reggie Kidd, Chuck Hill and Kenneth Gentry. It is still one of the best taped recordings available (from Stevens’ IPA publications). All that I can say at this point was that after R.C. published his book and J.S. Russell was reprinted again with R.C. writing a Forward, Preterism began to make its way into mainstream evangelicalism.
King, within the Church of Christ denomination, had lengthy debates, most notably with Jim McGuiggan (the McGuiggan/King debate is available on Planet Preterist). Living Presence had moved operations to Colorado Springs, Colorado under the guidance of Tim King, son of Max. Preston, Scott and Bell continued to labor in the fields in their own right (Bell, Preston and Scott are pastors in the Church of Christ). During this time, Moscow Press (Douglas Wilson’s outfit in Moscow, Idaho) published a book entitled ‘The End of All Things’ by C. Jonathin Seraiah, a Reformed Theological Seminary graduate (where I also attended for two years for Hebrew under Richard Pratt, Mark Futato, and Bruce K. Waltke). There was a brief written debate between Ed Stevens and Kenneth Gentry (which Gentry published in his book, ‘He Shall Have Dominion’ as an appendix). Ed Stevens wrote, ‘Stevens’ Response to Gentry.’ Gentry’s appendix, I believe, first appeared in Chalcedon Report, a Reconstructionist magazine, which I had subscribed to for many years. Keith Mathison wrote an appendix as well in response to what was being called “full” Preterism in his book ‘Postmillennialism: An Eschatology of Hope” (Presbyterian and Reformed Publications). Preterism, thanks largely to the efforts of Kenneth Gentry, David Chilton (who became a “full” Preterist months before his untimely passing away), James B. Jordan, and J. Marcellus Kik. These men were all Reformed (that is, Calvinistic). The battle lines were being drawn.
Seraiah’s book, in many ways, marked the first sustained attack against “full” Preterism. He referred to it as “pantelism” (from the Greek “pan” which means “all” and “telos” which means “end”). It was that book that caused me to write ‘Misplaced Hope’ (available on Planet Preterist). I wrote it in 6 months on my kitchen table with my trusty laptop that I stole from my wife. I was Reformed. I was schooled in the same places these men were. And they were flat out wrong. I wrote it from that conviction.
When I began to enter into the fray, I was not aware of the various movements within Preterism itself. I was involved in my Hebrew studies and did not stay abreast of these various things, and I also owned a lucrative janitorial business. When I came back into the mix, Preterism had grown! Bi-Millennial Publications agreed to publish my book, and after that, it was a full time endeavor. Within one year after the publication of that book (after seven years of cleaning toilets for a living), I was invited to pastor a new work in St. Petersburg, Florida. After much prayer, I accepted.
Seraiah’s book was still the only thing out there that was a major attack on Preterism. However, as the movement continued to grow, that would change. It is a clear sign that a movement (for lack of a better word) is gaining momentum when critics become louder. R.C. Sproul, Jr, one of the most vitriolic of critics, wrote the Forward for Seraiah’s book, and Pratt, Sandlin, and Gentry endorsed the back cover. It would be these men, minus Sandlin (of Chalcedon Report, and Razor Mouth.com) that would write a massive response, ‘When Shall These Things Be?’ from a major publication house, Presbyterian and Reformed Publications. The Reformed take their creeds seriously. Yet, they want their Preterist cake, too!
John Anderson began to have a conference three years ago along with Virgil Vaduva in Dayton, Ohio. Christ Covenant Church began to put a conference on as well in October of 2002. Dr. Kelly Birks was our first keynote speaker. Gary DeMar, William Bell, Jack Scott, Don Preston, John Anderson, Ovid Need, and your truly became frequent conference speakers. Tim King continued to put on a conference in Colorado Springs. More books began to flood the tables. More books were being written against Preterism, notably, best selling author Tim Lahaye and Thomas Ice in ‘End Times Controversy.’ We sponsored a debate between Ice and Preston in 2003. Living Presence sponsored a conference attached to the Society of Biblical Literature in 2003 in Atlanta. Jay Adams, best selling Christian author, wrote ‘Preterism: Orthodox or Unorthodox? (Timeless Texts).’ I would say, then, that by 2002, Preterism had hit a major nerve.
Never before in the history of Preterism has it enjoyed such a sustained momentum. Russell could not boast of such things. Kurt Simmons and the Tom Kloske wrote two massive volumes exploring the doctrine of Preterism. Ward Finley, Don Preston, John Noe, Dave Curtis, Ovid Need and several, several others have put out important works on this issue. As stated, one could literally attend the conference in Warren, Ohio back in 1999 and see very few books. Just recently, at John Anderson’s conference, there were well over 25 titles devoted solely to this issue!
As I listen to Dr. Steven Sizemore and Don Wagner give a history of Dispensationalism and the Christian Zionist efforts, I am awed by the fact that they, too, started the same way. They sponsored small ‘prophecy conferences’ back in the nineteenth century. After 100 years, Scofield hit the scene. Hal Lindsey brought it into such a popularity as never before in the 1970’s and LaHaye has revived this popularity. Dispensationalism is still not 200 years old. So, where are we?
Living Presence Ministries and the Transmillennial think tank has boldly moved into uncharted waters. I do not believe that the ramifications of placing the Second Coming of Jesus have been fully explored, theologically speaking. Theology is my cup of tea (and philosophy proper as well). Christian dogma has been done within the framework of an incomplete redemption. It looks forward to an end of history. It has never been done with a framework that leaves history open within a completed redemption. For example, Calvin worked out the doctrine of sanctification with an eye always on the Second Coming of Christ to complete the process of the work of the Spirit in our lives. If that Coming has already occurred, however, then what? Calvin was right to connect the process of sanctification with the Second Coming, but since we hold that the Second Coming has come, then what? Are we made holy, entirely?
Some Preterists would say, “no.” We are not made totally holy until we physically die and “get” a new body to enter into heaven with. Others disagree. Still, what of the church? Are we to still meet regularly? Are there still leaders within the body of Christ? Is there, even, a body of Christ on earth to speak of at all? Some argue that we are in the glorified body now (corporately, in Christ’s body), and others say, no, we will get one in the future.
Still, others, assert that the rapture took place in C.E. 70 in order to “prove” why it is we have no “evidence” in the early church records of the Second Coming in that time. Some Preterists still maintain the gifts of the Spirit. Some are universalists, some are still very much particularists, seeing that most of the world goes to an eternal hell. Others have argued that the ‘hell language’ of the Bible is merely figurative of the C.E. 70 conflagration and is no more eternal than an ant. And, yes, we still have those pious souls that see all of this debate and simply want to love Jesus and stop “all the fighting.” All of this sounds remarkably like Christianity to me! I grew up with an Adventist father, who argued for annihilationism and the cessation of the gifts. My mother was Charismatic, and I was raised in the Pentecostal experience. Needless to say, our dinner time conversations were quite interesting indeed.
Preterism did not originate these topics. Universalism was around and some charge arose within Presbyterian circles. Annihilationism has been around for a long, long time and Ed Fudge, one of its most ablest defenders, is hardly a Preterist. The argument over the gifts is as old as the Pentecostal movement itself. Christians arguing that pastors are irrelevant is nothing new. Ever hear of para-church ministries and tele-evangelists? That argument started around the time of radio. If “two or three gathered together” means “church” then why not stay at home with your family and listen to a guy on the radio?
In the Reformed faith, as well, there is an intramural of debates occurring. Need we be alarmed that there are debates within Preterism as well? Is that not the nature of theology? Does Preterism solve the philosophical problem of many perceptions, many ways of seeing things? Or, rather, does it not suggest that we do, in fact, allow for a great room of error? Preterism is a new kid on the block, which means that for the history of the church, no one, and I mean no one, was discussing how to fit I Corinthians 15 into an C.E. 70 framework! So, would one contend that no one was saved until Preterism showed up? If not, then God has allowed error, massive error, to flourish while yet at the same time calling his people: “my people.” Does error discount us from salvation life in Christ? Obviously not. What, then, is the benefit of removing error from our lives? Why do we want to “get it right”?
Preterism, in conclusion, has come a long, long way. I, for one, welcome Transmillennialism to the table. I welcome Bi-Millennialism to the table. Thank God for Ed Stevens, trouble-maker that he can be. Thank God for Max King and Ward Finley. Praise the Lord that the Kloske brothers wrote a book. I say, let’s have more!!! Let Kelly Birks argue his point, and allow for King to argue his. Let’s throw it all out there and see where it goes. But, if we are not in dialogue….if we are not talking….if we are not even interested….then I can hear the death-knell of Preterism and Transmillennialism. Regardless of the ‘next wave’ of the future, nothing, and I mean nothing whatsoever, can replace dialogue and respect. Bring on your technological age, give us your age of space and travel, and bring on the new dimension of perception…but “without love, these things are only clanging cymbals” and entirely useless enterprises. In all of this, and in all of these travels I have learned one thing from Preterism: I can sit at the table with Church of Christ Arminians, Reformed Calvinists, Roman Catholic defenders, tongue-talking Charismatics, annihilationist liberals, and immortal body at death rapture in A.D. 70 proponents and love them. That does not mean that I abandon my presuppositionalist, Calvinistic, pro-pastorate, pro-church, gift-cessationist, anti-empirical, immortal body now Preterism. It simply means, “hey, brother, want to talk?” There is nothing like a debate over beer and pizza (sorry if that offends the “Jesus drank only grape juice” Preterists).
What happens in dialogue is that we find out that there is much agreement. Dialogue is not just a mere exchange of words. To actually have dialogue, one must have action: dialogue involves sitting at the same table. You would be amazed at the fact that some within Preterism cannot even bring themselves to do this simple task. Talk is an action. It is the first action towards, hopefully, many other actions within the community at large. I can say that this approach, which is my own, has brought many brothers and sisters into my life, and I have learned from each one of them while disagreeing with each of them. Now, can that be all bad?
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Samuel Frost is a columnist for PlanetPreterist.com. Samuel is a MA Pastor of Christ Covenant Church in Tampa Florida. He is the author of Misplaced Hope and Exegetical Essays on the Resurrection of the Dead, both available in the PlanetPreterist bookstore.
View Samuel Frost archives
Note: Opinions presented on PlanetPreterist.com or by PlanetPreterist.com columnists may not necessarily reflect the position of PlanetPreterist.com, or reflect the beliefs, doctrine or theological position of all other preterists. We encourage all readers to first and foremost carefully analyze all articles in the light of God's Word.
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Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by Virgil on Wednesday, June 23 @ 07:10:04 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | | Sam, thanks for this fair presentation of Preterism today...it almost brought tears to my eyes. How far we've come...not because of our own efforts, but because of God allowing us to do so, and giving us the privilege and opportunity to present truth to the masses... |
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- by pretgirlinca on Wednesday, June 23 @ 11:03:09 PDT
- by RevDrCR1 on Wednesday, June 23 @ 11:05:12 PDT
- by TK on Wednesday, June 23 @ 18:52:40 PDT
Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by rfwitt on Wednesday, June 23 @ 07:30:46 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | Before I read any of the above authors I fortunately came across the website of Todd Dennis:
http://www.preteristarchive.com
I personally believe this is the best "Preterist" website for personal study. Why was that left out of your article???
Richard...... |
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- by Virgil on Wednesday, June 23 @ 08:46:51 PDT
Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by jaredcoleman on Wednesday, June 23 @ 08:58:25 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | Yeah, thanks Sam! Since I'm a pretty new preterist this really gives me perspective on the movement. I recently read the comparative dispensational book "Three Views on the Rapture" (pre-, mid-, and post- trib), so it is apparent to me that intramural debates will always be happening in any movement.
Your two best comments:
1. All of this sounds remarkably like Christianity to me!
2. There is nothing like a debate over beer and pizza
Amen. |
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- by Virgil on Wednesday, June 23 @ 09:03:59 PDT
- by jaredcoleman on Wednesday, June 23 @ 09:40:48 PDT
- by PreteristAD70 on Wednesday, June 23 @ 18:37:01 PDT
Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by jacaley on Wednesday, June 23 @ 09:34:06 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | I first heard of Preterism during a lectureship being held at Freed-Hardeman college during the early 1970s. During a Q&A session, Max King's book was brought up. The speaker (Gus Nichols) was very disrespectful toward Mr. King - but that is why I remembered it and later read Mr. King's book - I've not looked back since - I said to myself that day that Mr. King must have something right to get them so upset -
Since we are not inspired - we must discuss and study and work it out on our own. Does preterism have it all correct? - No - As you can see from Mr. Frost's article - many have come to different conclusions within the "preterist" camp. But it is encouraging to see the tide changing - slowly -
hopefully in 200 years preterism will become more mainstream.
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- by chrisliv on Wednesday, June 23 @ 10:34:28 PDT
- by zerubbabel on Wednesday, June 23 @ 11:01:02 PDT
- by chrisliv on Wednesday, June 23 @ 11:55:17 PDT
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- by Virgil on Wednesday, June 23 @ 12:27:29 PDT
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- by chrisliv on Wednesday, June 23 @ 23:12:24 PDT
- by demario on Thursday, June 24 @ 06:28:06 PDT
Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by Ninilchik on Wednesday, June 23 @ 16:12:20 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | | Sam. as usual, you continue to surprise me. You hit the bullseye with this article. Sometimes reading you reminds me of the way Martin Luther could tear away at someone he disagreed with. However, he was just as capable of sitting down at the table with them to hash things out. God help us if we ever loose that ability and desire to communicate and get our point and vision of what we believe God has said across to others. Hey bro, I still owe you a half rack of "Alaskan Amber". You just have to remember that you're going to have to come up here to Alaska to get it. Thanks again, The old Alaskan, Russ |
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- by BigD on Thursday, June 24 @ 12:24:40 PDT
Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by William on Thursday, June 24 @ 09:53:20 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | Having undergone a paradigm shift of seismological proportion (I live in California), I continue to travel down the satisfying road of "biblical common sense". The Scriptures never made so much sense once I realized that the Son of Man had actually come, and it didn't look like what they had told me at the local church.
I'm thankful for many for pointing the way. And I'm thanking you for the spirit in which your article was written. Yes, let's all dialogue and dialogue as deeply as possible, but with a spirit of inclusion and understanding.
I must highlight my favorite part of your text:Christian dogma has been done within the framework of an incomplete redemption. It looks forward to an end of history. It has never been done with a framework that leaves history open within a completed redemption.
Let's keep that in mind as we lovingly dialogue and interact with our christian family
and our world around us.
William Cheriegate www.doctrine.net
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Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by Zorro on Friday, June 25 @ 20:52:12 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | | Excellent article, Sam. The church has historically gone through periodic theological epochs. They typically take a long time to get through; Christology, for example, took over a hundred years, but arrived at a steadfast answer that has endured for centuries. I think Eschatology (which has always been on the back burner) may have become OUR epoch and responsibility to arrive at the same solid and enduring solution. I appreciate you perspective on this - patience and humility is the key. |
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We have just started (Score: 1)
by Roderick on Saturday, June 26 @ 19:25:10 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | Thanks Sam for the article.
As another person says, Christianity seems to go through epochs and it appears that eschatology is the latest epoch of understanding. It was not always that people understood how Christ was both man & God. It was not always that people understood the Triune nature of God. It was not always that people understood how the True Israel is now Christianity. It was always the people understood how we could be justified by faith alone.
AND
It was not always that people have understood the full nature of Christ's victory.
It is almost as if the town crier had been making his rounds in history:
Jesus is the Christ!!!
Jesus is man & God!
Jesus is part of the Triune God!
Jesus justifies by faith alone!
Jesus is completely victorious!
How long did it take for that last message to sink in? Certainly people have heard it since the first century just as they have all the other messages.
And now we all interact upon this great truth so long ignored, so long distorted by those who couldn't believe it. And just like all those other truthes about Christ -- there will be people who will resist and will not come and reason with us from Scripture but rather they will remain in their traditions, remain on the milk bottle, where it is safe & easy.
And even within this new understanding people will resist to move along...
"We'll ok Christ did come back in the first century...but only in judgment".
"Well ok, the kingdom is here...but not completely".
"Well ok, the Bride did wed the Bridegroom...but nothing has really changed".
As Sam has said, let us all continue in dialogue so that we can truly ascertain what the Scriptures say rather than being fooled by our own presuppositions.
Thanks for this article Sam,
In Christ victorious,
Roderick
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Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by Randude on Saturday, June 26 @ 21:13:33 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | | Thanks for the thoughtful analysis Sam! I really believe that anyone who heard the speakers at this years Truthvoice conference can see how God's power is at work in bringing us all together! A new spiritual day is dawning and our children will be the heirs! |
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Re: The State of Preterism Today (Score: 1)
by monosilence (imnothe@aol.com) on Monday, June 28 @ 13:44:46 PDT (User Info | Send a Message) | Sam, I appreciate this article very much. I am a viewer and a victim of the garbage that is thrown at each other concerning disagreements of issues--issues which are far from cardinal in doctrine and certainly do not threaten the doctrine of grace. I have been called an adherent of heresy for my preterist views, BY OTHER PRETERISTS! NEVER by a futurist. And my views are essentially near the middle of the road for preterism. If I were a futurist, I'd have to define the beast of Revelation as Christians who can talk the talk about grace but God forbid they should extend it to others, even of their own camp. I love preterism as a doctrine, but I am ashamed of us, truly.
Thank you for bringing attention to the fact that there are many differences. And guess what? It's okay!!! If we can't see this last point, then we don't know what grace is, nor how to live it. |
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